Shame On You Orange County Choppers..

Business is not easy. Especially when you have big business plans in the State Of New-York where unions are extremely powerful. Hundred of union members riding motorcycles and wearing tee-shirts reading, “Shame on you Orange County Choppers” protested against OCC employing non union employees to build their new headquarters in Newburgh, NY. The contractors involved in the construction deny these charges. The protest was calm throughout the morning and afternoon, but police broke it up to avoid any incidents and also because some OCC fans showed up at the scene and became upset,  The protest ended peacefully and there was no injuries and no arrests. Orange County Choppers

21 Responses to “Shame On You Orange County Choppers..”

  1. 1 CJ "Warden" Hanlon Aug 29th, 2007 at 12:04 pm

    I say “good for you OCC” if your not using union people….the unions have been a blight on this country for the past 15 years (and specific industries) by making it almost impossible to afford employees and forcing many companies to shut down operations. This country has seen enough of the self serving unions and their “Demands” for inclusion in the workplace. Personally, you can take all the unions and dump them in the ocean for all i care. Good for you OCC.

  2. 2 Pop Aug 29th, 2007 at 12:29 pm

    Well Duh.

    Here’s a couple of facts.

    Less than 20 cents out of every construction dollar in the US is paid to contractors and trades that are signatory to binding arbitration agreements.

    That’s down 75% from the 60’s and there are a lot of reasons. Some are bottom line reasons. Some are simply that organized labor has bloodied their own nose by not adapting to a changing marketplace. The perception of unions as adversarial is well earned. The term “deny the charges” reflects how defensive the contractors have become to see the act of hiring open shop tradespeople as some kind of chargeable offense.

    Open shop contractors call themselves merit shops. That scab thing is for workers that replace striking union employees. Open shop workers who are employees of contractors that have won the work through competitive bidding are called rats by the unions for not signing onto the union rolls.

    It’s hard to objectively align with a vocal minority that is badmouthing other working people who do not elect to pay dues to a multibillion dollar collective that is riddled with it’s own problems. On the other hand it’s somewhat easier to align with a market philosophy that says that if I do my job better I will be paid more, not the same, as some chunker that is loafing through life with a union book and the threat of work interruption (and the veiled threat of violence) to keep him employed. There are good and bad actors on either side of the fence but it is harder to lose the bad actors on the union side.

    I employ both union and merit shop subcontractors depending on who is best bidder. Different methods, similar results. In a tight labor market going with unions insures manning the job. In leaner times or on projects requiring fewer manhours, merit shops tend to deliver quality at a better price. Neither has a hand up on training or safety anymore. Federal regulations and state licencing have forced all sides to suck it up.

    So Paul Sr., while I wouldn’t give him a nickel of my money, is at least showing some business savvy by not unilaterally locking out 80% of construction workers from bidding on his work. There is nothing wrong with awarding work to the best bidder. There is something fundamentally wrong about denying all but 20% of the bidders the opportunity to win and perform the work.

  3. 3 Sid Aug 29th, 2007 at 10:27 pm

    Pop – good points.

    I can’t agree with “Warden” since there is too much generalized frustration in his comments.

    Getting rid of unions? Let’s first focus on CEO salaries being kept in check.

    I’m not suggesting the guy or gal that has the courage to put everything they have on the line to start their own business should not be rewarded healthy; but the CEOs of corporations (especially ones where they did not start the company) who are disproportionately paid compared to the workers who make it all happen.

    Unions do need to clean-up. They have become, in some ways, what they were originally founded to defeat.

  4. 4 Nicker Aug 30th, 2007 at 12:19 am


    Interesting stats…thanks:

    I have to agree “…There are good and bad actors on either side of the fence …”

    But it seems, as time goes by the Por-Con issues more and more form across generational lines. I’ve talked to young welders who say they don’t see any value from their union dues.

    But the old guys (like my welding instructor) who were around in the bad-ol-days still remember the union saving their butts.

    Years ago a girlfriend told me of a union meeting where the boys in control threatened to “talk to her out back” if she ever again asked the union rep to open the books on his expense account.

    Since the teamsters are threatening to hold up the Mexican Truckers that Bush has turned loos on us this week, unions don’t look so bad. That may be a thin tayional, but like the old welders, i don’t see many others trying to stop “totalization” or the “Anero.”……….:-(

    Does that fly in the face of “globaluzation”…?
    May be.

    “The enemy of my enemy is my friend”….?

    -The Nicker-

  5. 5 jatinder pal Aug 30th, 2007 at 8:32 am

    One who place the lowest prices,got the is as simple as that.think about it,every person searches for the right person at right prices,it is nothing wrong in that.
    it is business.

  6. 6 rodent Aug 30th, 2007 at 12:48 pm

    Yeah, but how many illegals are working on the project?

  7. 7 GARAGE GOON Aug 30th, 2007 at 3:53 pm

    OCC sux, but they’re shirts make great shop-rags!!!

  8. 8 Nicker Aug 30th, 2007 at 7:07 pm

    “…One who place the lowest prices,got the job…”

    Well…. may be, and may be not.

    Trucking in the US is highly regulated (drivers and equipment). We have enough truck accidents as it is.

    I’m not sure i want a bunch of third world trucks and drivers out there when i’m scoot-n down I-5.

    So if “lowest price” means 16 “may-pop-caps” and a clueless driver, i don’t see the cost benefit.


  9. 9 Joe638NYC Sep 1st, 2007 at 10:42 am

    Please by no means think that I for one second would argue that corruption in a lot of unions did not happen , I myself was in one who screwed with our pension fund , they went to jail and rightfully so , but the fact of the matter is that Many “open shop” general contractors (the overseeing contractor who runs the coordination of the sub-contractors) , use undocumented workers from “Ecuador , Mexico , Africa and many other nations ” they consider them “independent contractors” who must maintain their own tax payments , compensation and insurance costs etc. , they almost never do . They do not pay taxes , they do not complain about safety conditions for fear of “boss repercussions” , some are forced to work 12 hours a day , they do not have any voice in this country and are completely at the “bosses” mercy . This isn’t an argument about “Union Vs. Nonunion” anymore . Ask any open shop or independent contractor who hires “American born” or “Legally documented” workers what it is like competing against the new form of todays “Exploited shops”

    I have quite a few friends who are in the “nonunion” sect , that are finding it extremely difficult to get a decent working wage price for their jobs competing against the “Exploiting contractors”

    This isn’t just Union Vs. Nonunion anymore this is the complete downgrading of the working costs of construction at the expense of the exploited undocumented workers here in this United States .

    Remember , Unions in construction make the conditions better for all construction workers , when the added effect of “undocumented” “no right slaves” is added into the mix no one wins except those who employ them . Right here in New York we had the members of one of the bigger contractors on a job site who wanted to become union sign the cards , the general contractor shipped the workers to another site for a non-union brainwashing session , the vote came back 104-8 “approx. forgot the actual numbers” to stay non-union . They signed the cards saying they wanted to be union ? what happened in that meeting ? From

    ” At that meeting the workers were told by management that, ”unions were only for white people”, that management would have to be “shot” before it ever signed a union contract and that the workers “Questionable” legal status would prohibit them from any right to join a union. At the end of the hour long meeting the workers were told to write on a piece of paper whether or not they supported the union and sign their name to it.
    Naturally all of these acts violate a workers right to join a union and our union is in the process of fighting this company at the NLRB ( National Labor Relations Board). Ultimately many of these workers were scared away from supporting the union.”

    also a Long Island contractor was recently sent to prison for failing to pay taxes on his undocumented workers

    “A subcontractor who provided carpenters to many large-scale home building projects on Long Island pleaded guilty Friday to failing to pay federal taxes on the wages of his workers, many of whom were illegal immigrants from Ecuador working off the books, according to officials.”


    * in New York City you are 500% more likely to die in a construction accident if you are an non-union worker , most of the sites where this happened the employees spoke little or no English
    – in the fiscal year of 2006 (ending sept.06) 29 deaths occurred in construction in New York City
    – of the 28 incidents (2 died in one) , 24 were on Non-union sites
    – using the exploited is a safety menace to the employees and the public , why should anyone die for money

    * using non-union contractors who exploit the undocumented robs all of us of tax base

    * new union construction workers must graduate from apprenticeships which teach them their craft and safety techniques , how to be productive and within economical budget , if we stand around our employer goes out of business , efficiency is a top priority . Or are organized and evaluated for knowledge in their craft and set at an apprenticeship “grade” or become a full mechanic depending on experience .

    Yes , in the past the stuffed shirts in the unions did some despicable things , but now its about us the rank and file , working people , the US born and our children .

    Stop the degradation of the decent jobs here in the US , we work hard , in the rain , snow and 90 degree temperatures and deserve to get a honest days wage for it , stop the contractors from illegally using undocumented workers and skirting compensation , tax and safety costs .

    I’m sure if you were to see whats happening above the heads here on these “exploited shop” jobs in NY you wouldn’t want your kid working there or walking bye for that matter .

    thanks for reading,

  10. 10 Charles Lezette Sep 2nd, 2007 at 5:10 am


    GO TO:

  11. 11 Nicker Sep 3rd, 2007 at 3:29 am


    May be Unions have found a new calling:

    Stopping Bush and “totalization” (North American Union)

    And in the process getting the illegals out of the country.

    Hell, the politicians wont do it……. 🙁


  12. 12 David anthony Sep 7th, 2007 at 1:21 am

    That is what is cool about our country, write what you want, surf the internet for what ever you want, drive and travel when and where ever you want and hire someone to do your work or be hired to work. Last time I looked no illegal or union dude was even remotely close to being qualified to do my job, Hey now thats cool too

  13. 13 Nicker Sep 24th, 2007 at 12:57 am

    Page-4 Kawasaki is a good read…….

    thanks much.

  14. 14 Frannie Derm Oct 1st, 2007 at 3:14 pm

    The question is “are OCC employees being paid a decent wage and reasonable benefits”? I don’t know the Teutuls but I’d be willing to bet they are decent, ethical employers. Remember, their shirts are pure BLUE, not White. I’m sure they haven’t forgotten where they come from. In fact it seems to me that they are the same hard working guys they always have been. They absolutely deserve their success. Remember, nothing was handed to them: they built it all up themselves.

    Best of luck to Paul Sr., Paul Jr., Mikey, Vinnie, Rick, Jason and those whose names I don’t know. You deserve it: you’re alright in my book.

  15. 15 Dave Mar 18th, 2009 at 5:17 pm

    If you got 8 hours of work out of Union Labor I would say use it but you dont. Union labor is all about how to get more money and time off. I am in a Union and its worthless. I can see work rules… just look at the auto union guys full benifits when your not working COME ON!

  16. 16 Tom Jan 17th, 2010 at 10:44 pm

    Unions are the scourge of America. Thank God Unions only represent 12.6% of the American workforce.

  17. 17 h j Feb 15th, 2010 at 2:02 pm

    i used to be non union. i lived paycheck to paycheck, no health or dental insurance and few paid holidays. i now have insurance make a great wage and produce quality work. being from both sides, i now see that unions help raise the standard of living! yes, i do make substantially more than a nonunion worker in my field, but if there was no union to raise the bar, pay would be even lower. the true fact is that union jobs do not cost substantially more, but the fruits are spread a little more with the workforce in the way of a decent wage and medical benefits. in a nonunion job the company owner gets all the profits and his crew gets just enough money to keep them from food stamps. there are some nonunion shops that treat their employees well, but most just exploit them. yes there are some bad apples in unions that give us a bad name, but i get to work on time and give my all until its time to go home! i go to work every day and do a job that could end my life. i get paid well and i think i deserve it. why is it ok for someone who makes 10 or more times thw money i make fair for him, but because i make a little more than my neighbor im a bad person.

  18. 18 Ricky Right Apr 22nd, 2010 at 11:32 pm

    I am a Craft Union Representative. Those who were making comments that Union “are the scourge of America” couldn’t be more wrong and are surely non-union business owners. These blogs should ask the responders to indicate what they do for a living and where they work.

    Unions changed America and made the work place more open and safer for all workers. Unions brought the 8 hour day, overtime pay, the Occupational Safety & Health Act, Retirement Plans, Medical Coverage, worker collective bargaining instead of the boss always determining what you will work for, a grievance procedure instead of the bosses “open door” policy (you know – the boss says if you don’t like the policy there is the door ), journeyman and apprentice training in partnership with your employer, and belonging to your own organization where you can openly discuss issues that effect your workplace with your fellow Craft workers.

    I’m from California where 67% of the skilled Craft workers belong to their Union. All of the benefit plans provide for the Craftsmen and women to have contributions made by the contractors that they work for, from project to project. These plans allow a worker to work in California or any other State and have their benefits be paid into the same plan. This way they have continued medical coverage for their families and continue to build retirement no matter how many Union contractors they work for during their working years. What do the non-union contractors offer – open door policy, wages that change from project to project, no ongoing medical plan and no retirement plans that are stable from contractor to contractor.

    The construction industry doesn’t work for Craft workers without a Union. In fact, it doesn’t work well for non-union contractors either, but they haven’t experienced the difference or they just won’t admit it.

    We will continue to tell our story and we will continue to have the best wages, benefits and conditions for workers. If you haven’t joined a Union you should help the Union get a contract with the company that you are working with, so that you can have the best for your family too.

  19. 19 David Apr 22nd, 2010 at 11:51 pm

    Ricky Right are you still a Rep? I thought California was just about to fall off if the ocean and take your unions with it. Why dont you help your state out of bankruptcy with all your union dues or you could just move to Texas where there is a right to work law and few unions and we are doing fine here. Unions “might” have been ok in the beginning but they are just not needed now days. They are the reason everyting cost more. Because one guy cant clean up after hisself because it’s the unions janitors job or this other guy cant push that button because it’ the union button pushers job.And here’s the final one It’s probably what cost 29 miners their lives recently because the unions cost so much the owner(or whoever) cut back where he shouldn’t have to show a profit to the share holders.

    SSDD; David

  20. 20 JimC Apr 23rd, 2010 at 8:06 am

    I totally agree with David as we are pricing ourselves right out of the market. The Chinese are eating everyone’s lunch.

  1. 1 OCC having union trouble? - Page 4 - Kawasaki Motorcycle Forums Pingback on Sep 23rd, 2007 at 1:03 am
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